Comments on: FuelMaker Assets Finally Find a Buyer, Natural Gas Cars Still Stalled http://earth2tech.com/2009/05/01/fuelmaker-assets-finally-find-a-buyer-natural-gas-cars-still-stalled/ Helping the Earth with Technology Sat, 20 Mar 2010 10:50:50 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: TFDitmeijer http://earth2tech.com/2009/05/01/fuelmaker-assets-finally-find-a-buyer-natural-gas-cars-still-stalled/#comment-35828 TFDitmeijer Sun, 02 Aug 2009 07:56:36 +0000 http://earth2tech.com/?p=30333#comment-35828 <p>I don't understand this discussion, Fuelmaker was not the only one in this business. GTC is in Europe and Middle East the biggest one and said something also about pricing. We know that some companies in US are complain about competitors of fuelmaker but they must look in to themselff. not following about contract and to be the second hand of Fuelmaker.</p> I don’t understand this discussion, Fuelmaker was not the only one in this business. GTC is in Europe and Middle East the biggest one and said something also about pricing. We know that some companies in US are complain about competitors of fuelmaker but they must look in to themselff. not following about contract and to be the second hand of Fuelmaker.

]]> By: freedml http://earth2tech.com/2009/05/01/fuelmaker-assets-finally-find-a-buyer-natural-gas-cars-still-stalled/#comment-30370 freedml Mon, 04 May 2009 18:16:04 +0000 http://earth2tech.com/?p=30333#comment-30370 <p>Having your own personal compressor isn't the only way to drive a Natural Gas car like the GX.</p> <p>Before we had home fueling, we filled up at local commercial stations. It takes about as long as filling up a gasoline car and CNG costs significantly less than gasoline. Currently, gasoline in So. Cal. is $2.30 and CNG is about $1.80. In Utah it's still under $1.00!!! There are enough stations to travel in most of California and Utah. A number of major cities also have clusters of stations. A great map can be found at www.cngprices.com</p> Having your own personal compressor isn’t the only way to drive a Natural Gas car like the GX.

Before we had home fueling, we filled up at local commercial stations. It takes about as long as filling up a gasoline car and CNG costs significantly less than gasoline. Currently, gasoline in So. Cal. is $2.30 and CNG is about $1.80. In Utah it’s still under $1.00!!! There are enough stations to travel in most of California and Utah. A number of major cities also have clusters of stations. A great map can be found at http://www.cngprices.com

]]> By: freedml http://earth2tech.com/2009/05/01/fuelmaker-assets-finally-find-a-buyer-natural-gas-cars-still-stalled/#comment-30369 freedml Mon, 04 May 2009 18:09:25 +0000 http://earth2tech.com/?p=30333#comment-30369 <p>I believe Honda also has approved consumer GX dealers in Utah. And, fleet departments can sell the car to virtually anyone they want to.</p> <p>The price of Phill was indeed about $4k. I was quoted installation prices from $900 to $2000. Southern California has a $2000 air quality price support paid directly to FM, so my cost for Phill installed was about $3k.</p> <p>FM might have been worth more in bankruptcy than before, being able to shed its debt and marketing agreements through that process (hence the sale to an Italian company without having to maintain the distribution agreement with another Italian company).</p> <p>Phill may or may not survive the change of ownership, but Phill represented only a tiny percentage of the 14,000 installed Fuelmaker systems, all of which can fill fuel tanks much faster than Phill.</p> <p>"Small manufacturers" take new cars and retrofit them with CNG. A list is available here: http://www.ngvamerica.org/pdfs/marke...ses.NGVs-a.pdf</p> I believe Honda also has approved consumer GX dealers in Utah. And, fleet departments can sell the car to virtually anyone they want to.

The price of Phill was indeed about $4k. I was quoted installation prices from $900 to $2000. Southern California has a $2000 air quality price support paid directly to FM, so my cost for Phill installed was about $3k.

FM might have been worth more in bankruptcy than before, being able to shed its debt and marketing agreements through that process (hence the sale to an Italian company without having to maintain the distribution agreement with another Italian company).

Phill may or may not survive the change of ownership, but Phill represented only a tiny percentage of the 14,000 installed Fuelmaker systems, all of which can fill fuel tanks much faster than Phill.

“Small manufacturers” take new cars and retrofit them with CNG. A list is available here:
http://www.ngvamerica.org/pdfs/marke…ses.NGVs-a.pdf

]]> By: Katie Fehrenbacher http://earth2tech.com/2009/05/01/fuelmaker-assets-finally-find-a-buyer-natural-gas-cars-still-stalled/#comment-30274 Katie Fehrenbacher Sat, 02 May 2009 16:22:48 +0000 http://earth2tech.com/?p=30333#comment-30274 <p>Thanks for this. Honda markets them to consumers in NY and CA - if they're available in other states it would have to be through a fleet deal (Ill double check with Honda about this on Monday). The price I quoted for the Phill for $5500 to $6000 is the cost of the gear plus install and I got directly from FuelMaker. I do see that Fuel Systems Solutions has disclosed the price of the deal (my info was from Honda) so I'll update the story with the price of the deal.</p> Thanks for this. Honda markets them to consumers in NY and CA – if they’re available in other states it would have to be through a fleet deal (Ill double check with Honda about this on Monday). The price I quoted for the Phill for $5500 to $6000 is the cost of the gear plus install and I got directly from FuelMaker. I do see that Fuel Systems Solutions has disclosed the price of the deal (my info was from Honda) so I’ll update the story with the price of the deal.

]]> By: Christine http://earth2tech.com/2009/05/01/fuelmaker-assets-finally-find-a-buyer-natural-gas-cars-still-stalled/#comment-30264 Christine Sat, 02 May 2009 07:03:25 +0000 http://earth2tech.com/?p=30333#comment-30264 <p>Just to offer a correction and some insight - you can actually buy a Honda Civic GX CNG model in far more places than just New York and California. For example, they are available in Florida as well.</p> <p>Also, Honda actually loses $4,000 on every GX sold because they are committed to keeping the vehicle affordable. Despite that, they continue production (albeit limited) and increase production year after year. Wouldn't it be nice if more American automobile manufacturer's were so generous and supportive of alternative fuels that reduce petroleum dependency?</p> <p>FuelMaker had sunk nearly $24m into Research and Development which the company never fully financially recovered from.</p> <p>The cost of the Phill is actually about $4k. The price could go as high as $5k installed - but consider that you are factoring in permits, professional installation by someone licensed in plumbing and electrical work and signed off by a GC. $6k is a stretch, but I suppose a distributor could have sold it that high. The sticker shock fades away when you apply basic economics and realize your gasoline expense of $50-$100 a week disappears and your fuel now runs closer to $30 per month.</p> <p>A savings of 30% - 50% on fuel costs can certainly pay off that $5k investment nicely. Especially when gasoline hit $4 a gallon last summer (something it is expected to do again within the next year...)</p> <p>CNG and alternative fuels could use more supporters. Natural gas vehicles <em>are</em> available - Honda is the only OEM model at this time, but that could change significantly...especially as Fiat unveils 6 new CNG models and takes over Chrysler. Aftermarket conversions are another excellent option. The Ford Focus CNG bi-fuel model can be retrofitted brand new at the dealer level by approved Ford dealers.</p> <p>Also, the price tag for FuelMaker closed out at $7m - as has been widely reported.</p> Just to offer a correction and some insight – you can actually buy a Honda Civic GX CNG model in far more places than just New York and California. For example, they are available in Florida as well.

Also, Honda actually loses $4,000 on every GX sold because they are committed to keeping the vehicle affordable. Despite that, they continue production (albeit limited) and increase production year after year. Wouldn’t it be nice if more American automobile manufacturer’s were so generous and supportive of alternative fuels that reduce petroleum dependency?

FuelMaker had sunk nearly $24m into Research and Development which the company never fully financially recovered from.

The cost of the Phill is actually about $4k. The price could go as high as $5k installed – but consider that you are factoring in permits, professional installation by someone licensed in plumbing and electrical work and signed off by a GC. $6k is a stretch, but I suppose a distributor could have sold it that high. The sticker shock fades away when you apply basic economics and realize your gasoline expense of $50-$100 a week disappears and your fuel now runs closer to $30 per month.

A savings of 30% – 50% on fuel costs can certainly pay off that $5k investment nicely. Especially when gasoline hit $4 a gallon last summer (something it is expected to do again within the next year…)

CNG and alternative fuels could use more supporters. Natural gas vehicles are available – Honda is the only OEM model at this time, but that could change significantly…especially as Fiat unveils 6 new CNG models and takes over Chrysler. Aftermarket conversions are another excellent option. The Ford Focus CNG bi-fuel model can be retrofitted brand new at the dealer level by approved Ford dealers.

Also, the price tag for FuelMaker closed out at $7m – as has been widely reported.

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